Carlos Torano Exodus 1959 Silver (Twitter Review)

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Carlos Torano Exodus 1959 Silver (Twitter Review)

Carlos Torano Exodus 1959 - Silver

Some time ago, I received a surprise sample of the Cain Habano. Being told I had to smoke it on the spot, I decided that I was going to use twitter to convey my thoughts as it burned. The Twitter Review, or Tweet-View, had an excellent response and I wanted to do a more organized version in the future.

I posed the idea to my Twitter followers and immediate got a few people interested in smoking along with me. Once we ironed out a time, the Carlos Torano Exodus 1959 Silver was chosen as the cigar. Overall, I think that the style of review was a big success and I look forward to doing another in the near future.

I would like to thank everyone that participated, I had alot of fun and the results were interesting.

The following is the result of our review. You can use the Twitter Search function for #SRTV (Stogie Review Tweet-View) to see additional information.

Stogie Review Tweet-View


waltw: Alright, I’m just about ready. Lets all try to use the #SRTV hash-tag for Stogie Review Tweet-View since that’s what I am going to search

waltw: For those watching and confused, we are reviewing the Torano Exodus 1959 Silver for Stogie Review via a Twitter Review #SRTV

waltw: My wrapper is dark and oily with a uniform color. Coupe small veins but none protrude. Smooth to the touch #SRTV

KnightRid: @waltw prelight for me would be a very barnyardy smell, beautiful oily looking stick with a nice looking cap #SRTV

BudPA: @waltw #SRTV Mine looks the same but with a lot of shiny specks #SRTV

KnightRid: @waltw couple small veins, VERY small that stick up a bit, but thats it #SRTV

waltw: Aroma on my has a kind of chocolate / compost. Very aromatic overall #SRTV

tonycasas: sadly mine looks a bit on the dry size excellent construction dark creamy brown wrapper One small dimple i hope doesnt give problems #SRTV

waltw: Its probably worth noting that the cigars @BudPA, @shing999, and I are smoking could be relatively old. Not big movers at out shop #SRTV

tonycasas: Carlos Torano exodus 1959 silver edition torpedo #SRTV

BudPA: @waltw I would say they have a few years on them #SRTV

waltw: Stick feel evenly packed with tobacco but does have two soft spots. One towards mid-point the other near the cap #SRTV

tonycasas: @waltw @BudPA Yeah mine was a fresh box they actually opened there at the shop. Still a bit dry :/ #SRTV

KnightRid: @waltw mine has a nice firm pack to it, no soft spots at all #SRTV

waltw: Moving on to opening up the cap. using a typical double bladed guillotine (Palio). Pre-light draw is VERY free #SRTV

tonycasas: @shing999 I agree, great band. I love medievel looking bands. Represent power. Hopefully the cigar itself can back that up #SRTV

waltw: Cold draw has a very mild taste. Kind of hard to distinguish. I am a little concerned about the draw, virtually no resistance #SRTV

BudPA: I have a small nick in the wrapper about midway will have to keep an eye on it #SRTV

tonycasas: Very earthy scent, with grassy, nutty undertones – prelight. #SRTV

waltw: Pairing the Exodus 1959 Silver with a little @blackdogcoffee #SRTV

tonycasas: Heading to cut, using cuban crafters double blade perfecto cutter. #SRTV

KnightRid: I am pairing mine with some Coca Cola, maybe water after the Coke is gone πŸ™‚ #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid Im pairing with coke as well oddly πŸ™‚ #SRTV

First Third

waltw: Moving on to lighting now, no unexpected problems. Evenly lit and billowing smoke #SRTV

waltw: Soft on the palate with a mild salty after-taste. Moving smoke through sinuses causes no uncomfortableness, nice and smooth #SRTV

tonycasas: Cold draw, just as expected. Grassy. A bit musky. #SRTV

tonycasas: Light was cake. Lit up right away when my lighter actually worked properly. #SRTV

BudPA: Burn getting a little uneven will see if it corrects itself #SRTV

waltw: Resting smoke is fairly light but has a musty quality to it. Not bad, but not the most appealing smell either #SRTV

tonycasas: @shing999 Agree with the retrohale. Its not something i do often but very smooth on this smoke #SRTV

tonycasas: Great draw. Lots of think smoke. A bit of spice up front. Very sweet, nutty flavors. #SRTV

waltw: Thin and even burn line so far. Tiny ash that is developing is light in color and attractive #SRTV

tonycasas: Cap seems to have a bit of sweetness to it. #SRTV

KnightRid: Couple photos for #SRTV – sorry took forever to upload

KnightRid: I would say mostly woody on the start, aftertaste doesnt linger too long it doesnt seem #SRTV

tonycasas: Ash is pretty light. Actually has a light brown tint to it. Starting to develop a stong tobacco aftertaste early on. #SRTV

waltw: Main flavor seems to be woody followed by a very interesting salty flavor on the tip of my tongue. #SRTV

tonycasas: Draw started weakening. Went in for an extra clip on the ol’ torpedo. Getting a massive draw now. #SRTV

BudPA: Ash is very light gray almost white, burn line very thin and seems to be evening out #SRTV

KnightRid: burn is NOT even on mine, hopefully it will correct itself #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid Mines burning evenly, it’s just really loose and flaky. Hopefully it fixes itself #SRTV

BudPA: Getting some spice up front followed by a slightly sweet sensation #SRTV

KnightRid: VERY flaky ash on mine – flakes off every time I move it, it seems. #SRTV

tonycasas: @Mr_Squiddy I just can’t punch. Tried it. Not for me. The more raw draw the better! #SRTV

KnightRid: – hopefully able to see the uneven burn #SRTV

waltw: @shing999 Could be anything. I suppose salty is best way to describe. Its a sensation on the tip of my tongue that is pretty unique #SRTV

tonycasas: @waltw @shing999 I’m getting the salty taste on mine as well followed by soft spice, with slight nutty undertones. #SRTV

BudPA: @shing999 I must be a slow smoker I’m only into it about half of what you are #srtv

waltw: Draw is very free but not as bad as I was expecting from the pre-light. Produces lots of dense and flavorful smoke. #SRTV

tonycasas: Almost an inch in and I fear the ash is going to give out any second. Its tightening up a bit now though. #SRTV

KnightRid: Here is my flakey ash #SRTV

KnightRid: oh I forgot – I did PUNCH this cigar, I did not cut #SRTV

BudPA: @waltw I’m getting that sensation on the tip of my tongue but mine doesn’t seem like salt #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid Looks almost identical to mine I’ll be adding a few pics here soon, im a bit behind. #SRTV

KnightRid: getting a bit of spice now along with the woody taste and I got a bitter aftertaste for a short second also. #SRTV

KnightRid: ash fell off already just by sitting it on my ashtray – not a good one to smoke with an ashtray CLOSE at hand πŸ˜‰ #SRTV

KnightRid: @shing999 LOL – I punch em all dammit – lets me relieve tension =) #SRTV

KnightRid: that should be WITHOUT an ashtray CLOSE at hand #SRTV

waltw: Flavors of Wood, Mild Spice, Nuts, and that Saltiness on the tip of the tongue. Smoke seems mildly acidic (aggressive) on palate #SRTV

tonycasas: I only got this far until the ash gave way. A bit disappointed #SRTV

BudPA: Getting a lot of spice in the finish #SRTV

KnightRid: I am getting a slight tingling on the back sides of my tongue – is that the acidic you were talking about @waltw ? #SRTV

waltw: – Torano Exodus 1959 Silver – First Third – #SRTV

tonycasas: The draw is MASSIVE. I’m liking this.Very smooth smoke.Especially this early in the morning (for me) #SRTV

waltw: Body is medium (mouth-feel). Nicotine level is going unnoticed. Burn is a little wavy now and becoming thicker. #SRTV

KnightRid: @waltw wow, nice ash – mine is still VERY flakey!!! #SRTV

tonycasas: @waltw agreed almost no sign of nocotine. #SRTV

KnightRid: burn line is still not even, keeps waving about quite a bit #SRTV

waltw: Burn rate seems on par with other robsutos. Not smoking as quickly as I would have thought due to the free draw. #SRTV

waltw: The sensation on the tip of my tongue lingers for some time before fading. Not sure I’m liking it, becoming an annoyance. #SRTV

BudPA: Really an abundance of smoke on every draw , I like that #SRTV

waltw: @KnightRid No, just feels aggressive across the roof of my mouth. Sort of like the acid in orange juice #SRTV

tonycasas: This smoke is burning a lot slower than expected. burn line is pretty consistent. Ash is tightening up a bit more.. finally #SRTV

KnightRid: Ash and burn line still not very nice πŸ™ #SRTV

KnightRid: RT @BudPA: Really an abundance of smoke on every draw , I like that #SRTV – very much so – NICE amount of smoke!

tonycasas: @shing999 you’re smoking fast man, im not far into mine at all. Its taking a while and im going at it too #SRTV

waltw: @shing999 @KnightRid I don’t think it anything to do with the age. Probably just a denser fill in our box/batch #SRTV

KnightRid: @tonycasas lol – take your time and enjoy it πŸ˜‰ #SRTV

KnightRid: still getting nothing on the tip of my tongue, nor on the back sides now – last puff was very smooth and creamy #SRTV

KnightRid: ash fell again with just sitting it on the ashtray – of course, I would get the bum stick..LOL #SRTV

tonycasas: Barely right here on mine. Hitting at least twice a minute or so #SRTV

KnightRid: strength for me would be a solid medium so far with no nicotine detected as of yet #SRTV

KnightRid: do I have the wrong stick? why is mine so dark and @tonycasas so light? SIlver should be natural shouldnt it? #SRTV

tonycasas: Strength is very mild for me. Very smooth smoke.No nicotine detected. Still very creamy, softly spiced. picking up subtle coffee? #SRTV

BudPA: Burn line very thin but wavy #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid My stick is very dark #SRTV

waltw: @KnightRid Silver is only available in one wrapper type as far as I know. Mine is fairly dark as well #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid it might just be the lighting, mine is pretty dark. The foot is VERY dark, and lightens up towards the head. #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid keep in mind mine was a bit dry to begin with #SRTV

tonycasas: Just ashed again. About 3/4’s inch on the second ash. bits flaked off all the way though #SRTV

waltw: Touch-up required. Let it stand too long in the ashtray as I took some photos. Need to re-light #SRTV

waltw: Ash was average in strength. Took a very light tap to remove it from the foot (about an inch in length) #SRTV

KnightRid: at about the 1/3 mark still mainly woody, spice is gone, everything is gone but maybe a bit of leather in the background, kind of dull #SRTV

waltw: Finish on mine is a bit dry. Giving me that parched / dry-mouth feeling. #SRTV

waltw: – Still working on the first third of my Exodus Silver – #SRTV

KnightRid: ok soda gone, switched to water – see if I get more from it. #SRTV

BudPA: Just developed a big soft spot right below the band, will have to keep an eye on it #SRTV

tonycasas: Retrohales nicely, losing a bit of flavor as well but it just adds to the character. #SRTV

waltw: Flavor level seems about medium, same as body. A little laid back for my taste but not bad. A touch of harness. #SRTV

BudPA: Re-light required wrapper does not appear to be burning at the same rate as the rest of the cigar #SRTV

tonycasas: @waltw agreed this cigar would be a lot better if it had a bit more kick. How is it compare to the Gold Edition? #SRTV

BudPA: Getting more flavor in the finish then in the smoke itself #SRTV

waltw: @tonycasas I prefer the Gold. Seems to have more richness and character #SRTV

KnightRid: about 1/3 done – still flakey as anything #SRTV

Second Third

waltw: @BudPA I agree, it seems to have more in the line of Residual flavor than it does in the up-front smoke #SRTV

tonycasas: A bit more than halfway though. Impressed with the even burn, and smoothness. Not impressed with the loose ash and lack of punch #SRTV

waltw: Closing in on the second third now. Flavor seems consistent without much change. A little richer but that is to be expected. #SRTV

waltw: Smoke is very dense but carries a drying affect with it that I am not overly fond of. Constantly sipping on my coffee to combat #SRTV

KnightRid: – finally it let me upload the 1/3 pic #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid Looks indentical to mine in burn. My burn line is starting to go crazy now. #SRTV

BudPA: I expected more spice then I am getting considering that this has a criollo wrapper #SRTV

waltw: Resting smoke occasionally drifts past my face. Its a little on the rough side and may be considered offensive. #SRTV

tonycasas: @BudPA agreed. #SRTV

KnightRid: In my non-expert view, this is a boring cigar so far almost half done and its just mainly woody, might be moving to high-medium for me #SRTV

KnightRid: still no burn issues except it not being straight πŸ˜‰ no relights or touch ups as of yet #SRTV

waltw: @KnightRid I agree, its one dimensional and lacks any significant change of pace. #SRTV

waltw: @BudPA That is interesting, I would have never guessed that it had a Criollo wrapper. #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid What are you talking about high medium for you? You nubbed a cain that raised the bar for you #SRTV

KnightRid: wow – just got a hell of a hit of spice at the back of the throat and through the retro-hale..almost tears lol #SRTV

waltw: Burn line is a little wavy but not troublesome. It is also thin for the most part. Resting smoke is fairly light in volume. #SRTV

tonycasas: Still goin strong #SRTV

KnightRid: @BudPA LOL – I think if I get through the Cain maduro, my palette will change..hahaha – didnt smoke one yet, worried πŸ˜‰ #SRTV

BudPA: @waltw would have never guessed that this was a criollo had to look it up #SRTV

KnightRid: RT @waltw: @BudPA That is interesting, I would have never guessed that it had a Criollo wrapper. #SRTV – 100% agree, for what THAT means LOL

waltw: About an inch away from the band now. That salty sensation on the tip of the tongue is turning to a ticking sensation, annoying. #SRTV

tonycasas: Wow. touched up a bit as the wrapper isnt burning consitent with filler and got a massive spice intake. #SRTV

KnightRid: DEFINITELY getting some spice now, and I do think I just tasted that saltyness @waltw had #SRTV

waltw: Ash is light and color and holds a nice compact shape. No flaking going on, nice and tidy. Strength is about average I suppose. #SRTV

KnightRid: @shing999 you finished yours yet? πŸ™‚ #SRTV

KnightRid: wow – harshness lingering a LONG time at the back of the tongue/throat – not very nice #SRTV

Final Third

waltw: Becomes far more aggressive on the palate as I enter the final third. Heavy acidic feel across the roof of my mouth. #SRTV

KnightRid: burn line has finally about evened up for me! ash is stronger also! #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid The cain maduro seems milder then the habano #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid @waltw we fianlly hit the sweet spot, all close to the band too. #SRTV

KnightRid: might be feeling a bit of nicotine also – not sure, just a bit of a “whew” #SRTV I need an interpretor =)

waltw: Getting a harsh spiciness on the back of my tongue (outside edges) and in the back of my throat. #SRTV

waltw: Flavor density is medium. Nicotine still unnoticed. Body is medium. Finish is dry. #SRTV

tonycasas: Getting a lot harsher. The back of my throat is starting to get annoyed. Still not feeling the nicotine #SRTV

BudPA: Burn getting really wavy now #SRTV

waltw: Flavors: Woody, Mild Spice, Nutty, with a building black pepper aroma/taste on the retrohale. #SRTV

BudPA: Haven’t gotten anything in the throat yet but the roof of my mouth is getting hit hard #SRTV

KnightRid: around the band #SRTV –

KnightRid: band came off with no problems at all #SRTV

KnightRid: @shing999 yes, at the beginning and now towards the final 1/3 it is getting bitter again! #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid Yeah your wrapper i so much darker than mine now that I see it #SRTV

KnightRid: @tonycasas how far along are you? #SRTV

tonycasas: @shing999 Yeah its getting really bitter. Still really spicy at this point, slight leather taste. #SRTV

BudPA: My wrapper could almost pass for a maduro #SRTV

KnightRid: amazing how cigars can change between puffs – last puff was smooth as a babies butt #SRTV

KnightRid: awful lingering aftertaste, like others have said, though #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid about 1/2 inch to band. I had the larger vitola, trying to go at it hard to keep on base with you guys #SRTV

KnightRid: @tonycasas seriously man, slow down, enjoy – if you overheat it, you will end up ditching it early (at least in my experience) #SRTV

tonycasas: Getting really spicy. tingling my lips quite a bit #SRTV

KnightRid: @shing999 you my friend, are a smoking machine =) #SRTV

KnightRid: yea, I definitely feel a little bit of nicotine #SRTV #yesIamawuss

waltw: – Final third of my Torano Exodus Silver. #SRTV

waltw: Time to remove the band. Harshness growing and becoming unpleasant. Room aroma getting heavier and more unpleasant as well. #SRTV

KnightRid: HEY, I just tasted nuts!!! kind of a toasted nut of some sort #SRTV

tonycasas: Getting ready to remove the band #SRTV

waltw: Way too much glue on the band. Removing it tore a fairly large chuck from the wrapper leaf. #SRTV

KnightRid: @waltw WOW – mine actually slid off!! #SRTV

tonycasas: Band came off clean. A lot of un-needed glue but not any on the wrapper #SRTV

BudPA: @waltw I can see some glue sticking out from under my band think it will be a problem will let you know in a sec #SRTV

KnightRid: ruler says I have about 2 inches left on this stick – mellowed out, cept for the aftertaste – really awful #SRTV

waltw: Lots of dry-mouth at this point. Oily coffee is helping alot. Couldn’t smoke this cigar without some sort of beverage. #SRTV

BudPA: Band removed , a lot of excess glue but did not stick to the wrapper. #SRTV

waltw: @BudPA Piece of wrapper that tore off on mine seems very thin and delicate. #SRTV

tonycasas: lots of relights needed, wrapper is cracking quite a bit around the burn line #SRTV

KnightRid: my band #SRTV

BudPA: @waltw wrapper does look thin, but had no problem with the knick I had in mine #SRTV

KnightRid: this wrapper reminds me of the CAO Sopranos actually #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid great pictures man! #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid I had to peel my band off would not come lose #SRTV

tonycasas: Spice is gone, after taste is just awful at this point. Starting to feel the noctine. #SRTV

KnightRid: I cant get over how awful the aftertaste is, wont be making my regular or even semi-regular line up #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid wish I had a camera handy so you could see all the glue on the back side of it #SRTV

waltw: @KnightRid Between the harshness, very dry finish, and aggressive quality of the smoke, I don’t see this regularly in my future either #SRTV

KnightRid: I was impressed how my burn evened out – never had to do a touchup yet and it is almost perfect right now #SRTV

BudPA: Starting to get some spice on the initial draw and a little throat irritation on the finish #SRTV

KnightRid: @BudPA I hate when they are glue happy!!! bands rip in pieces, cigar wrapper tear – awful, just awful! #SRTV

waltw: Smoke remains dense and flavorful, just getting bored with the flavor. Too consistent for my liking but not a terrible smoke. #SRTV

KnightRid: If I wouldnt be doing this twitter thing, I would probably kill this thing, thats how awful the aftertaste is! #SRTV

KnightRid: but I will soldier on, for your reading pleasure =) LOL #SRTV

waltw: Tear in the wrapper from removing the band doesn’t seem to be creating a problem. Burning right through it. #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid I guess the extra age on my stick made the glue brittle as the band didn’t tear at all #SRTV

KnightRid: @waltw the aftertaste does it for me – have to drink just to get rid of it πŸ™ and VERY 1-dimensional I would say #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid I totally agree. Im not feeling this cigar much. Aftertaste is ruining it. But I’ll take it down as far as I can #SRTV

BudPA: Getting very acidic tasting #SRTV

tonycasas: Lots of wrapper crackage #SRTV

waltw: From a burn and construction standpoint, this cigar is solid. No real problems beside excess glue on the band. #SRTV

KnightRid: oh yea the draw is AWESOME, huge amounts of smoke with little effort – only good thing I can really say #SRTV

waltw: @shing999 I agree, the presentation was very nice but the sick left much to be desired. Earlier portions of the stick were much better #SRTV

KnightRid: my stick is getting a bit warm also at about 1.5 inches left #SRTV

tonycasas: Doubt I’ll nub it. I’ll give in once you guys do. The draw is the best part, the burn is pretty consitent too. #SRTV

waltw: @KnightRid I’m about at the same point. Warm on the fingers and the smoke feels a bit hot on the draw. #SRTV

KnightRid: that bitter/acidic taste is coming back with a vengeance on the back sides of my tongue also #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid that bitter/acidic taste is coming back with a vengeance <-- same here #SRTV KnightRid: @waltw i didnt expect it to get warm with how nice and easy the draw is – go figure! #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid maybe i just need to wash it down with something? Gasoline maybe? haah #SRTV

BudPA: Water gone switched to lager much better #SRTV

KnightRid: is anyone else getting a lingering aftertaste ? man, it goes away but it you move your tongue a bit, it comes right back – yuk #SRTV

KnightRid: @tonycasas lol – I wish I still drank, I would grab a beer with this one to try and drown out the aftertaste #SRTV

tonycasas: @KnightRid The aftertaste has been with me for a while. Mine isnt getting warm though, about an inch left #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid Yes, bitter aftertaste #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid The lager does seam to kill the aftertaste better the the water did #SRTV

waltw: Going to be setting this down very soon. Its well past its prime and not getting any better. #SRTV

KnightRid: @BudPA bet it made it a LOT more enjoyable πŸ˜‰ #SRTV

BudPA: @KnightRid yes it did only wish I would have switched sooner #SRTV

waltw: I am officially done with my Torano Exodus 1959 Silver. Smoke time was about 1 Hour 50 Minutes. had a blast guys, love to do it again. #SRTV

KnightRid: little crack at the punch hole, ash still a little flaky #SRTV

KnightRid: @waltw WHEW – so I can let this bastard die – thank god – LOL #SRTV

KnightRid: final thoughts – flakey ash, burn corrected itself nicely so no problems there, PLAIN woody taste with a bit of nut mixed in #SRTV

KnightRid: AWFUL aftertaste – just awful! I would not recommend this. #SRTV

tonycasas: Final Thought. Decent construction. Great earthy, nut spice flavors at the begining. Amazing draw. Good burn. Very smooth start #SRTV

tonycasas: Awful aftertaste, Lack of flavor and strength. Too dry for my taste. The back of my throat was very annoyed towards the end #SRTV

tonycasas: I WOULD NOT have this cigar again. Myabe something with a bit more power next time πŸ™‚ #SRTV

BudPA: Final thoughts . Very good construction, good draw and an abundance of smoke. Flavor seamed to be lacking had to search for it. #SRTV

BudPA: Aftertaste really put a negative to the enjoyment of this stick #SRTV

Walt’s Photos from the Review

enjoying cigars since 2005

7 thoughts on “Carlos Torano Exodus 1959 Silver (Twitter Review)

  1. It was a fun experience, I hope to be involved again in the future πŸ™‚

    Awful cigar though – ewwwwww – I think we should ban Walt from picking the next one – LMAO


    1. Glad you had fun! It was a blast and I’m looking forward to doing it once again.

      Next time I need to come up with a better system for transferring the tweets. It took me forever to copy and paste all of the tweets into the review. I’m too busy during to do it as they come in, maybe I’ll have to be more selective and on what I post rather than posting everything.

      Thanks for participating

    1. Wonder what happened there. I didn’t even realize that I was seeing his name in mentions and not in the search results themselves.

      It must be because his updates are protected, so his comments were shielded from the Twitter Search. That really sucks, I’ll have to go back through my personal timeline to grab his tweets.

      I didn’t even think about what would happen if someone had their updates protected.

      thanks for catching that. I was going cross eyes with all of the copying and pasting and didn’t even notice.

  2. Interesting way to review a cigar.

    -I agree with Walt it would be nice to have just the highlight tweets in the future. Maybe have a link with the raw feed of tweets and just display the highlight ones. I am sure if you smoked a better cigar the raw tweet stream would be more interesting.

    -How about you announce it in the future and we can get as many as possible and in the recap you can give a summary like 6 of 31 smokers would smoke the cigar again and 2 of 31 found it box worthy. Like state on Oct 15th at 8pm EST the SRTV members are going to smoke a Gurkha His Majesty’s Reserve (HMR), go buy one and be ready to smoke at that time on twitter, or StickAm or one of those social sites we can all gather at.

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